Let's start a junkyard fuel injection discussion

Ken Henry said:
I used ‘classic braid’ from Painless Wiring. It has a dull finish like cloth and I’m really happy with it. Unfortunately it’s not cheap and it’s best to buy a few different diameters.
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Thanks Ken, Awesome recommendation. I looked it up, it looks awesome and our local supplier carries it in stock. I ordered the whole chassis kit which has a wide variety of sizes, $240 CDN, p/n 70970.

Cheers
 
Awesome! I hope you like it too! I think it looks so much better than the plastic corrugated stuff. I usually cut it and punch holes w a junk soldering iron, since it IS stranded plastic despite looking like cloth
 
Ken Henry said:
Here are a few pictures of my setup. The throttle bodies are Ducati S4R and have one injector each that squirts in below the throttle plate. I swapped the green top Ducati injectors for yellow Subaru injectors that flow ~50% more fuel, as I found the duty cycle was close to maxing out on the originals. Megasquirt is a little tricky to get the hang of and uses TunerStudio running on a laptop for tuning. I bought the 'full' version for a few dollars and it has an autotune function that helps get the fuel map dialed in. There is no way I could got it working without that feature! Other hassles:
running a fuel return line, installing a high pressure electric fuel pump (I put mine in the stock tank), and fitting the trigger wheel to the 8ba crankshaft pulley. I originally tried to run the ignition with Petronix in the distributor and Megasquirt as the coil driver, but couldn't get it to work well. The Ford EDIS system is a little older now but very robust and works great. This was my first conversion. I've since done the same on my Corvair and it was much easier thanks to lessons learned! Each conversion has to be at least $1500, though I don't dare try to add up receipts for any of this. I'm on the younger side for the flathead crowd at 42, which might explain part of the draw to fuel injection; tired of fuel drying up in the bowls or percolating on a hot day and flooding the engine! The driveability is about the same otherwise. Power is up slightly but that's more attributable to going from the stock single to dual intake manifold I think... Ken


50943217798_2bd5d45aa3_b.jpgDEB4B753-9179-4C19-A7A7-0254C2A6C133 by kenhenry_06268, on Flickr
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Great setup Ken! How did you connect the throttle bodies to your manifold? Saw in another picture that it's a normal flathead 2-carb manifold. What 3-hole carb adaptors did you use and how did you attach the throttle bodies?
 
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Thanks! They are Thickstun adapters that I got on ebay, designed for mounting a holley or stromberg 3 bolt carb onto a one barrel intake manifold (2 bolt). I had a friend in the machine shop cut off the mounting ears on the 1 barrel side and turn down the inside and outside diameter to match the throttle bodies I had in mine. The throttle bodies are mounted to the adapter with rubber hoses and hose clamps, similar to some motorcycle setups.


With two one barrel throttle bodies squirting into both planes of the intake manifold, both injectors have to operate at the same time (once for every ignition event) to get an even fuel distribution to the cylinders. There is simply not much time to get enough fuel in at WOT and "high" RPMs (4000 rpm = 3.75 ms between ignition events). You can use high-flowing injectors but they can have trouble idling well due to the very short on time. I solved this by adding a set of secondary injectors, perched above the velocity stacks, that come on when needed. Better yet would be a system with 2 barrel throttle bodies that maintains the separation between intake planes. The you have 7.5 ms to get the fuel in...



49614591741_1dd5bb50be_b.jpg6281357E-DA50-4FCF-AA98-DFAC266ABB9D by kenhenry_06268, on Flickr


51145067169_cca73f9f31_b.jpg85263390-22BA-409C-B463-E67B4E81D095 by kenhenry_06268, on Flickr
 
Ken Henry said:
Thanks! They are Thickstun adapters that I got on ebay, designed for mounting a holley or stromberg 3 bolt carb onto a one barrel intake manifold (2 bolt). I had a friend in the machine shop cut off the mounting ears on the 1 barrel side and turn down the inside and outside diameter to match the throttle bodies I had in mine. The throttle bodies are mounted to the adapter with rubber hoses and hose clamps, similar to some motorcycle setups.


With two one barrel throttle bodies squirting into both planes of the intake manifold, both injectors have to operate at the same time (once for every ignition event) to get an even fuel distribution to the cylinders. There is simply not much time to get enough fuel in at WOT and "high" RPMs (4000 rpm = 3.75 ms between ignition events). You can use high-flowing injectors but they can have trouble idling well due to the very short on time. I solved this by adding a set of secondary injectors, perched above the velocity stacks, that come on when needed. Better yet would be a system with 2 barrel throttle bodies that maintains the separation between intake planes. The you have 7.5 ms to get the fuel in...
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Awesome! Thanks for the additional information. Easy to see how that interface would work well. Just need to find a local shop to do the work to match the throttle bodies.
 
Kilohertz,
I was not expecting to find this cool thread, but I'm certainly glad I did. I'd love to do something similar on my 8Ba. I'm going to have to dig deeper into this. Nice work.
 
Detroit Flathead said:
Kilohertz,
I was not expecting to find this cool thread, but I'm certainly glad I did. I'd love to do something similar on my 8Ba. I'm going to have to dig deeper into this. Nice work.
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Thanks for the compliment, much appreciated. I have made a lot more progress and will make another update once it's all back together. I decided to strip the injection system off to paint the engine and firewall then start to reassemble it, permanently so I can carry on with the main chassis wiring etc. . The computer harness is all installed and looks great, I have a new alternator to mount and a few coolant sensors and electric fan switch to put in, then the rad,....then I should be able to start it again.

Stay tuned.


Cheers

https://www.dropbox.com/s/nj7755ypdhka7dn/IMG_1442.MOV?dl=0

picture.php


https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qv6BOXxbjOfF6ENsPtpYW0bmVF6Qmn2X/view?usp=sharing
 
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Looks fantastic! Did you end up trying the classic braid wire wrap? I’m having two a “TBI” holley 94 carb tops printed for my setup. Will post back with photos when they arrive.
 
Ken Henry said:
Looks fantastic! Did you end up trying the classic braid wire wrap? I’m having two a “TBI” holley 94 carb tops printed for my setup. Will post back with photos when they arrive.
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Thanks Ken,

Yes, classic braid...$240, but there's enough to do several vehicles, maybe more. It's best cut with a hot wire as scissors just mangle the ends.

cheers
 
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51 MERC-CT said:
My question was posted for the OP.
Are you speaking for the OP?
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I am speaking for the Forum discussion thread. This is a forum. The OP stated he wanted to start a discussion. Everybody joins in to a discussion. You have the option to send a personal message if you don't want others to comment.
 
Ken Henry said:
Awesome! I hope you like it too! I think it looks so much better than the plastic corrugated stuff. I usually cut it and punch holes w a junk soldering iron, since it IS stranded plastic despite looking like cloth
Click to expand...

Just re-read the thread and missed this, great idea, I was going to build a hot wire setup but I have a number of Weller guns here and will try those first, maybe mod one to use hot nichrome wire.

cheers
 
And here we have a Holley 94 carb partially converted to a TBI unit using a custom 3d printed air horn. The material is nylon PA12, resistant to high temperatures and very strong and rigid. It cost about $75 to be done by a commercial printer (Shapeways.com). This setup will allow me to retain the stock choke cable to control the idle speed and take full advantage of the dual plane manifold design. A fuel rail will be mounted above the air horn with two fuel injectors in it sort of like a GM TBI. More pictures to come in the next few days once I get the fuel rail cut and drilled!! Ken


51911992339_5caffc9cfb_b.jpgB74D07A6-EFF3-48E0-9606-FAC2E0025CCE by kenhenry_06268, on Flickr


51912271280_191dee458a_b.jpgCF8EA0E2-67E9-4BB2-94E9-6F0AF501FB06 by kenhenry_06268, on Flickr


51911652926_45a64cb976_b.jpg02863C07-B01E-46DA-869B-8337226745E0 by kenhenry_06268, on Flickr
 
That's brilliant Ken! Nice work!!

What injectors are you planning to use and what fuel pressure? Is it MegaSquirt control?

Looking forward to seeing the next phase.

cheers
 
Thanks! The fuel injectors are high impedance from a BMW S1000RR motorcycle and supposedly flow 22.8 pounds/hr (240 cc/min) at my fuel pressure of 43.5 psi. I will measure it confirm though, as well as estimate the dead time since that is an important parameter for megasquirt. I'll will continue using my dual carb intake (so 4 injectors total) and distributorless ignition system with the megasquirt controller. Ken


s-l400.jpg
 
Since 2015 I've been running 2 - 1988 Ford Escort 2.0 liter TBI's on my flathead V8 with mega squirt II software. I used 3/8" thick aluminum plate adapters mounted to 2 Stromberg 97 bases on an Offenhauser super dual manifold.

I figured a standard 239 cu inch flathead is 3.92 liters, so 2 TBI's from 1988 2.0 liter 4 cylinder engines would be a good match.

Oh and an OEM TBI will run about $150 on EBAY....well it did in 2019.
 
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