Engine Noise - Help-Opinions?

mgambuzza

mgambuzza

Senior Member
Today I was taking a nice drive when at a stop sign, the engine was clacking louder than usual. By the time I got home it was very noticeable. Looking to the experts for advice. Took a video of it.



Not sure if may be something with valves or pistons/bearings. I will say I noticed a significant decrease in power.

Since I'm not in the position to do a rebuild myself, and if it may be, does anyone know of anyone trustworthy the Upstate NY - Syracuse area that could do it?


Truly discouraging after a summer of great drives and memories.


It doesn't do the noise at first, but once warmed up it is definitely more pronounced. I'll post additional videos in a bit.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWgLx9aXewk
 
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From the sound it is likely that the engine was run out of oil.

Rods and or main bearing damage from the noise that I hear.

This engine has an oil breather cap which is not designed for a Model A.

Many times a cap such of as this will be clogged up and restrict the flow of blow by out of the breather tube.

When this happens pressure builds inside crankcase and all of the oil is forced out the rear main cap.

If cap is blocked enough 5 quarts of oil can be forced out in as little as 70 miles.

The correct cap should have NO restrictions like a plate with small holes and some sort of steel wool like items stuffed in the cap or breather tube.
 
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Could be timing gear or valve. Try shorting out plugs one at a time. 3 should sound similar and one odd if it is a valve. If you think it is a valve try Marvel Mystery Oil,drain out a quart of oil put in a qt of MMO. If it is a timing gear, listen with stethoscope.

Get a good idea of what it is before you tear it apart. Good Luck
Dan
 
Sounds like noise is in the valve train somewhere.

Please don’t just start taking things apart.

Check you oil level. Do you use Marvel Mystery Oil in your gas?

Not knowing more than your comments and short video. If it was my car, I would change the oil, using 20w-50 high detergent, than add one blue bottle of STP as the last half quart. Remember, only four and one half quarts are needed unless the oil pan has been dropped. Than MMO in you gas.

To me it sounds like a lot of Model A’s I have been around that just need some attention. Noisy valves, high mileage on engine, etc.

$20.00 could be very well spent. I have given this advise many times over the years. Most of the time it has worked out and gotten many more years out of an older engine.

Good luck.
 
if it is knocking after warming up but it doesn't knock when cold, it might be excessive rod to crank clearance being cushioned by thickened oil. once the oil warms up, my guess is that the oil flows faster and the pressure drops causing the knock. Is my theory correct? I have heard of this with diesels but it might apply to model a engines as well due to the low oil pressure of these engines.
 
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Before my timing gear failed, it made a faint sound, that none of my Model A friends could really diagnose, and it ran just fine until it finally stripped out. Not really very noisy.
 
Benson said:
From the sound it is likely that the engine was run out of oil.

Rods and or main bearing damage from the noise that I hear.

This engine has an oil breather cap which is not designed for a Model A.

Many times a cap such of as this will be clogged up and restrict the flow of blow by out of the breather tube.

When this happens pressure builds inside crankcase and all of the oil is forced out the rear main cap.

If cap is blocked enough 5 quarts of oil can be forced out in as little as 70 miles.

The correct cap should have NO restrictions like a plate with small holes and some sort of steel wool like items stuffed in the cap or breather tube.
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It was low, but I don't believe out. I make it a habit to check before I venture out. Also, I've ordered a proper cap as yes, I have been losing oil.
 
WHN said:
Sounds like noise is in the valve train somewhere.

Please don’t just start taking things apart.

Check you oil level. Do you use Marvel Mystery Oil in your gas?

Not knowing more than your comments and short video. If it was my car, I would change the oil, using 20w-50 high detergent, than add one blue bottle of STP as the last half quart. Remember, only four and one half quarts are needed unless the oil pan has been dropped. Than MMO in you gas.

To me it sounds like a lot of Model A’s I have been around that just need some attention. Noisy valves, high mileage on engine, etc.

$20.00 could be very well spent. I have given this advise many times over the years. Most of the time it has worked out and gotten many more years out of an older engine.

Good luck.
Click to expand...
I will try this next in the sequence of tests - when Mrs. G isn't yelling at me for spending too much time with the Model A mistress.
 
Terryh, The the metal timing gears tick or click real loud. Can be really confusing if you have a loose center main at the same time. mgambuzza do you belong to a club where you can get some local help.

My Mrs L looks at the Model A as a Husband Sitter.
 
I am going to go with the timing gear. If you run the video at 1/4 speed it sounds like a gear. But that could be just the way digital sounds are displayed at 1/4 speed. It does not sound like an exhaust leak but check that first.
 
BTW - I do use MMO in my gas religiously.


Changed the oil and replaced with 20W50 4qt with STP. This time started, ran almost 20 min with only a hint once in a while of the noise. Will investigate removing the belt, and maybe compression testing as when I do hit the accelerator the engine increases, but not like it would in the past. Thinking this, along with already demonstrated loss of power will be a more major issue.

If anyone is from Upstate NY and can recommend a mechanic in the Syracuse area, it would be greatly appreciated. Definitely not the way I wanted to end the season, but if it is a major issue, at least it can be worked all winter to be ready in the spring.
 
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mgambuzza said:
BTW - I do use MMO in my gas religiously.


Changed the oil and replaced with 20W50 4qt with STP. This time started, ran almost 20 min with only a hint once in a while of the noise. Will investigate removing the belt, and maybe compression testing as when I do hit the accelerator the engine increases, but not like it would in the past. Thinking this, along with already demonstrated loss of power will be a more major issue.

If anyone is from Upstate NY and can recommend a mechanic in the Syracuse area, it would be greatly appreciated. Definitely not the way I wanted to end the season, but if it is a major issue, at least it can be worked all winter to be ready in the spring.
Click to expand...


I would put car away for the winter and not worry about it. In the spring, give the oil and MMO a chance to work. These engines take a licking and keep on ticking. They will go forever.

Point of interest. Our 1929 came out of a barn in Virgil, New York in 1980. It had been in storage since the end of WWII. Sounded like yours when we first started it. 40 plus years later, no rebuild and running strong.

Give it a chance. Clean your carburetor and check timing, points, and plugs. These could each be causing a portion of your problem. Alone with sticking or SLOW valves, MMO in gas will help that.

Route 11 down thru Homer is a great drive for Model A’s.

Enjoy.
 
WHN said:
I would put car away for the winter and not worry about it. In the spring, give the oil and MMO a chance to work. These engines take a licking and keep on ticking. They will go forever.

Point of interest. Our 1929 came out of a barn in Virgil, New York in 1980. It had been in storage since the end of WWII. Sounded like yours when we first started it. 40 plus years later, no rebuild and running strong.

Give it a chance. Clean your carburetor and check timing, points, and plugs. These could each be causing a portion of your problem. Alone with sticking or SLOW valves, MMO in gas will help that.

Route 11 down thru Homer is a great drive for Model A’s.

Enjoy.
Click to expand...
Funny you mention that- in September I remember driving my wife to Moravia on around Sept 19 and saw a bunch of cars heading from Homer to a show. I was also aware of the Jordan car show that weekend. When I returned at 1 that day I looked up and saw the show in that area finished at 3 and didn’t think I’d make it in time. Hopefully when it’s healed I can make that show next year.
 
OK - problem seems to be solved. Tried the oil change, STP - it didn't do it for about 20 minutes then the intermittent knock started. When I started to listen for it (long handled screwdriver), it showed to be around the front of the engine. Its been a long season and I was feeling tired of troubleshooting myself and looked for someone who could really analyze it.

I did the Google searches, and one by one I'd call, state the year, then the silence, then a dead end. I finally called and when I mentioned a 1930 Model A, she said you want to talk to my grandpa. Spoke with him who owns a few Model As of his own as well as others, and after looking at their site (they had positive reviews from other classic car owners), I decided to flatbed to his shop. I figured this was going to be an all winter project but to my surprise he called me two days later and he said it was going to be a camshaft gear. The original had holes that were elongated and when I saw it started to look like Good and Plenty in shape. Ordered parts from Snyders, and while in there I asked if he could replace the leaky pan and look at the bearings to see if any issues. He called me 2 weeks later to pick up - between that call and the price (well below what I would have imagined) I was happily floored!! Thankfully no issues with the bearings, starts great, runs great, and even after 30 minutes of idling no noise or knocking - success!! Now can't wait for Spring once again so I can try to exceed my 1000 miles from last year. Thanks to all for your input!!
 
Thanks for the update. I love happy endings.

Did you put the aluminum gear in? It is a little noisy but lasts a lot longer than the fiber gear.
 
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