Did I fry my starter relay?

I

ironfly28

Junior Member
So like a dummy I left an after market electric fuel pump in the ON mode for a few days... Came out to start my '38 deluxe and the only sound I got was crickets. And lots of dark. Dead, nothing no lights...nada. So I unhooked the batteries and charged them up to a good 5.86 volts. The previous owner wired two six volts in series with a cut off switch on the deep cycle Marine battery and an optima at the back of the tray... anyway, I go to start it...and I have juice but when I ground the starter I get a noise like heavy radio static and no turny. Did I somehow fry the starter relay...can I arc it back to life? Should I beat the starter with a hammer...or do I walk down to CW Moss and start buying stuff?
 
5.86v is a dead battery! The battery has to at least be above 6.0V. It is at around 25% charge. It is possible that the battery is toast after being connected to a load for that period of time. I would take the battery to a shop that can load test it. Most auto parts shops can.

Leaving a load on the battery shouldn't have anything to do with the starter solenoid, it is only activated when the starter button or switch is connected. You would have to hold the starter button for a very extended period of time to damage the solenoid.
 

Attachments

  • maxresdefault.jpg
    maxresdefault.jpg
    50.5 KB · Views: 29
Last edited:
Wouldn't hurt to re-check your battery connections and ground just to rule out a loose connection. (Idiot Boy over here had to learn this the hard way....thanks to brother-in-law, unnecessary starter replacement avoided!:eek:
 
RKS.PA said:
Wouldn't hurt to re-check your battery connections and ground just to rule out a loose connection. (Idiot Boy over here had to learn this the hard way....thanks to brother-in-law, unnecessary starter replacement avoided!:eek:
Click to expand...

Even with good connections that battery is not going to do much at that charge level!
 
Thanks for this chart! I didn't realize the margins were so tight. I guess I'm used to Turbine engines where you can have 30% under voltage and still get a start. On Morning inspection I discovered that what I thought was the charger kicking off at 5.86 was actually an I advertsnt trip of the switch. My 6 year son was the first to alert me to under voltage when he honked the horn and it sounded like a sad goose. To which he said "Dad, I think our girl is sick". Battery one is at 6.3 now and two is coming up nicely at 5.93. As mentioned I did take the opportunity to check connections and I do think the starter relay is a little loose but I'll wait until we have ignition to start fiddling with it. Thanks for the help!
 
Apologies... semantics. I mean to say the ground cable has a little play. But it's been starting fine that way for the 4 months I've owned it and for an untold amount of time before that so I'm not going to address it until it's running again.
 
ironfly28 said:
Apologies... semantics. I mean to say the ground cable has a little play. But it's been starting fine that way for the 4 months I've owned it and for an untold amount of time before that so I'm not going to address it until it's running again.
Click to expand...

You may have too, just to get it running.

It's not the looseness per say, it's the conductivity. Just because it's been that way for a long time does not mean it's right and not causing a problem.

A 6 volt system is very sensitive to grounds and good clean connections. By far this is the main issue with 6 volt.

The cables and wire need to be large enough.
The connections need to be clean.
The connections need to be tight.
 
So is your 1938 Ford a 6 volt car as original or a 12 volt car, as you have said the two 6 volt batteries are connected in series which will give 12 volts ? Or are the two 6 volt batteries in parallel ? Where is the cutout switch fitted? Different types of batteries should not be connected together either in series or parallel. Your description is not very clear. Regards, Kevin.
 
It is a six volt car... positive ground. I'm not sure why he put in two batteries but I presume it's to assist with the modern light bulbs the car is running. I also assumed that maybe the second battery was for backup. I just don't know. For clarity the negatives are wired together the positives terminate at the same point on the body...
 
ironfly28 said:
It is a six volt car... positive ground. I'm not sure why he put in two batteries but I presume it's to assist with the modern light bulbs the car is running. I also assumed that maybe the second battery was for backup. I just don't know. For clarity the negatives are wired together the positives terminate at the same point on the body...
Click to expand...

In this case, the batteries are wired in parallel and not in series as your original post seems to convey.
 
They are in parallel, thanks. If you look at them without taking into account positive ground they're in series...see what I mean? Anyway, what issues would dissimilar batteries create? If they're rated the same and grounded equally what trouble could they make?
 
If the batteries are not the same they conflict with each other. They charge and discharge at different rates.
 
Negative or positive ground has nothing to do with series or parallel. Series
is when the negative on one battery is connected to the positive of another
battery.
 
I never could get parallel and series right. Two batteries one point for electricity to flow is what I'm dealing with...the rates for charging are way different as exemplified by the time it took to charge the optima versus the conventional battery.
 
I think I understand the logic but it's flawed. A Deep Cycle and a conventional battery wired in series is not a good idea. Both are different animals. Deep Cycles are designed to be discharged completely, thus being able to be recharged from dead, again and again. Deep cycles are designed for gradual draws at a long duration. Deep cycles have half the cranking amps but can last longer on a charge.

Conventional batteries have twice the cranking amps and are designed for heavy draws at a shorter duration. Conventional batteries are not designed to be totally discharged.

Conventional vs Deep Cycle, as said they are two different animals.

I suspect the car has a weak or non functioning charging system and has been "fixed" to run off batteries alone. That's the reason for the deep cycle in series.
It could possibly last a long time on a charge. With that said, it's not right.

My advice, rip that Rube Goldberg battery system out and repair the car correctly.

PS...

What can happen when batteries are wired up in an unconventional manner?

I'll summarize in one word.

BOOM!

I have seen this first hand. BOOM. This was a fire engine with batteries wired in series hooked to a shoreline charger. It worked for a long time and then one day...boom.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top