Ford-O-Matic - adjustment?

Rusty_S85

Rusty_S85

Member
Have a little problem with my transmission, first time car has been driven since 1984/85.

Transmission shifts great with a little stumble off idle but that's engine performance, the shifting of the transmission while driving is fine no slippage or anything.

Problem is when I come to an idle the transmission falls out of gear into neutral making a whining sound as if it has no fluid. I shifted into L gear and it goes into gear and stays. I think it has something to do with line pressure.

The rod at the bell crank for the transmission line pressure I adjusted as per the manual, inserted 1/4" drill bit into bellcrank to properly lock it in position, then I pulled the rod for the transmission up against its internal stop adjusted the clevis till it fit then went 3 turns counter clockwise to move it just off the internal stop.

1956 shop manual states to not go more than 3 turns.

I am wondering would it hurt this old transmission if I give it a bit more through trial and error half to one turn at a time till it stays in gear while idling?

Or is it something that needs to be addressed internally in the transmission?

Thing shifts great, I stepped on it to the floor while driving at 30 mph felt it down shift easily and held it till it shifted to the next gear at nearly 60 mph then I went into coast mode.

Odd thing for me though is once I got back in the driveway and just sat there idling I checked the fluid level after driving to make sure it didn't go low on me after all the air got purged and its still full. Put it in gear it whines before it goes into gear but it will stay in gear with foot on brake. It only does this falling out of gear when I come to a stop and slow down to about 10 mph. Last stop pulling into driveway it didn't do it till I was almost stopped then I had to downshift it into low to get it to go in gear again to pull up drive way.

I don't know might need a overhaul which I don't know who I would have do it but I just don't think it needs a overhaul since it shifts beautifully for its age its just this low speed coming to a stop issue.
 
Sounds to me like a foreign object is blocking pressure in drive when converter is turning slowly. First thing I would do is drain old fluid, drop the pan and inspect to see if there are chunks or unusual gunk in there. Remove the filter screen and spray it out good with solvent. Allow to dry and re-install. Clean inside of pan real good and install with a new gasket.
Remove converter half-moon front cover at bottom and rotate crankshaft till one of the drain plugs is at bottom. Remove drain plug and drain old fluid. Re-install everything.
Fill with Mercon/Dexron transmission fluid while engine is idling and stop when the fluid level reaches about the middle of the marked area on the trans fluid dipstick.
Do not do anything further to the passing gear link adjustment. If the trans is shifting at the proper time, it is good.
Test drive and see if there is improvement. If not, maybe time for overhaul. Probably just needs good cleaning.
 
Daves55Sedan said:
Sounds to me like a foreign object is blocking pressure in drive when converter is turning slowly. First thing I would do is drain old fluid, drop the pan and inspect to see if there are chunks or unusual gunk in there. Remove the filter screen and spray it out good with solvent. Allow to dry and re-install. Clean inside of pan real good and install with a new gasket.
Remove converter half-moon front cover at bottom and rotate crankshaft till one of the drain plugs is at bottom. Remove drain plug and drain old fluid. Re-install everything.
Fill with Mercon/Dexron transmission fluid while engine is idling and stop when the fluid level reaches about the middle of the marked area on the trans fluid dipstick.
Do not do anything further to the passing gear link adjustment. If the trans is shifting at the proper time, it is good.
Test drive and see if there is improvement. If not, maybe time for overhaul. Probably just needs good cleaning.
Click to expand...

The transmission keeps losing fluid as the check valve is no good but I read the Ford-O-Matics were known for draining back over night. So Ive essentially changed the fluid with how many quarts ive had to put in it over the last 4 years topping it off till I found my yoke was missing the plug and that's where my leak was.

the transmission has been serviced at regular intervals but not since its been sitting since the 80s. Will be a experience for me as the dipstick if I remember right threads into the bottom of the pan.

I will order a gasket and filter set before I pull the pan cause I might as well throw a new filter in there just since its apart.

On the fluid, ive been running Accell Type A since the transmission has never been overhauled.

But thanks for the reply I don't know the symptoms for a transmission like this. All my books I have are from when it was all new so it doesn't give any information on age related issues that comes up with age.
 
Most places don't sell type A anymore, but sometimes you can still find it at big farm/tractor supply outlets. If you can get type A, that is good. Use it.
Yes, to drain the fluid, you unscrew the dipstick tube on the passenger side of transmission pan.
If overhaul is needed, be careful who you assign to rebuild it. It is better to have someone familiar with cast-iron Ford-O-Matics. Find someone you can have some level of trust. Be sure to get guarantee.
 
Daves55Sedan said:
Most places don't sell type A anymore, but sometimes you can still find it at big farm/tractor supply outlets. If you can get type A, that is good. Use it.
Yes, to drain the fluid, you unscrew the dipstick tube on the passenger side of transmission pan.
If overhaul is needed, be careful who you assign to rebuild it. It is better to have someone familiar with cast-iron Ford-O-Matics. Find someone you can have some level of trust. Be sure to get guarantee.
Click to expand...

Yep I have a few sources of getting Type A. I mostly buy it from Amazon they got the Accel Type A and I think summit sells it also. The gas station/grocery store center I stop at from time to time sells Texas Gold Type A fluid as well.

If it needs to be rebuilt I don't know who I would take it to. I don't trust anyone. Im partially tempted to attempt to rebuild it myself using my shop manual.

But it comes back to the transmission shifts too good for me to think it needs a overhaul. Its just falling out of gear coming to a stop. But the oddest thing is if I am already stopped in the driveway which does angle the car to the rear a little I can shift it into drive it will whine for a bit then go into gear and stay in gear.

So I don't know if something is shifting around to the front when braking and is blocking something causing it to fall out of gear or what.

But when I first made the adjustment to the transmission as the shift point rod/kick down adjustments were way out in left field the transmission didn't whine at all it would shift right into gear. but the whine before falling into gear came back over time and now I have the right intake and carb back on so I remade the adjustments.

Car has sat from the early 80`s so for all I know something could have oxidized inside the transmission sitting that long and broke lose and is causing this problem. Or maybe the filter isn't a mesh filter but a paper element like was on my 78 Mercury. This transmission was serviced at regular intervals I got records from the 60`s for transmission service with mileage.

Well guess I will have to make the swap I was going to buy another case of Accel Type A and amazon shows its unavailable guess Accel isn't making it anymore.
 
Last edited:
Falling out of gear at low speed sounds like fluid pressure starvation, but when speed is increased, pressure builds up and overcomes whatever is blocking it at low speed.
How many actual miles are on the car? It may be overdue for a rebuild. One of the worst things about these Ford-O-Matics is old dried out and worn rubber gaskets and O-rings, especially the front converter O-ring and the converter hub O-ring. If the trans sat for long periods of time, you know they had dried out, but they may have cracked which means there will be little annoying leaks all the time.
Years ago I had a lot of trouble finding a reputable and professional shop whom I could trust with my Ford-O-Matic rebuild. I passed up three places in different towns whom I felt un-easy with after talking to them in person. Finally found a shop in a different town that is very good, trustworthy and does quality work. Eventually, if you search, you can find somebody.
 
Daves55Sedan said:
Falling out of gear at low speed sounds like fluid pressure starvation, but when speed is increased, pressure builds up and overcomes whatever is blocking it at low speed.
How many actual miles are on the car? It may be overdue for a rebuild. One of the worst things about these Ford-O-Matics is old dried out and worn rubber gaskets and O-rings, especially the front converter O-ring and the converter hub O-ring. If the trans sat for long periods of time, you know they had dried out, but they may have cracked which means there will be little annoying leaks all the time.
Years ago I had a lot of trouble finding a reputable and professional shop whom I could trust with my Ford-O-Matic rebuild. I passed up three places in different towns whom I felt un-easy with after talking to them in person. Finally found a shop in a different town that is very good, trustworthy and does quality work. Eventually, if you search, you can find somebody.
Click to expand...

Miliage on it based off records I have is 155,000 miles. Transmission was serviced Aug 2 1963 at 75,600 miles. My records don't show another transmission service since 75,600 miles and the car is currently on 55,000 miles on the odometer. Guess its about time to do another service anyways. That means right now transmission is at 79,400 miles. Guess I will give it a go doing a transmission service.

I know gaskets do dry out and leak but as of now ive been running the car the last 4 years and it hasn't leaked any fluids out of it out side of the transmission leaking out of the driveshaft yoke itself as the plug on the back side was missing.

Only other leak I have is coolant, one core plug is rotted out where it drips but its not bad enough that I cant run the car. I like to think the car being stored in a open shed with a dirt floor that it helped preserve the vehicle. I brought the car home and it had ruby red transmission fluid in it. So I don't know doesn't mean there cant be some kind of internal leak.

I just cant say on local transmission shops. I just cant trust any of them as ive seen way too many of them do bad work.
 
The only downside I can see to doing your own rebuild is that you will find there are some special tools needed to dis-assemble which are not available, but professional trans repair/rebuild shops have all the tools. Some of these you will see if you review the 1956 Ford-O-Matic shop Manual.
 
Daves55Sedan said:
The only downside I can see to doing your own rebuild is that you will find there are some special tools needed to dis-assemble which are not available, but professional trans repair/rebuild shops have all the tools. Some of these you will see if you review the 1956 Ford-O-Matic shop Manual.
Click to expand...

Yep I know. I have the part numbers down Ive been trying to locate some of these tools but with no luck. One I really want to get just to have is the lifter tray for in car lifter replacement. But that is just doesn't exist now.

I think what I might have to do is just search online see if I can find someone local that specializes in old transmissions

I forgot there is a guy that sells old cars and does restorations as well as general service on old cars he might be the guy to ask who he recommends for transmission work if not he himself.
 
like Dave said, clean it first. Do the simple stuff. It was good when ya parked it back then......
 
Gene F said:
Rusty, please be sure to post the final result here, so we can all learn, ok?
Click to expand...

I will do that.

As far as how it was when it was parked I don't know. I know the car was driven in a limited fashion as there were other vehicles being driven instead. Only reason why the car was parked was the owner, my grandfather passed away in '86 and it has sat from around that time period.

But when I get this resolved I will do an update. I really want to drive the car more as of now I don't think its safe to be sitting in L to keep it in gear and start moving then bump into D. Plus its a lot to remember to do since I have to flutter the throttle a little. not sure why that engine revs fine in neutral so might not be that might be a load related issue there. But I will focus on that second as the transmission issue is the first I want to resolve.
 
Internal leakage from worn/cracked/hardened seals. It's over 60 years old, what do you expect from this poor thing? Get it redone. And no, snake oil won't fix it.
 
Your trans is very similar in design to the FMX series used by Ford up into the '80's. Some parts even interchange. So your trans should not be a mystery to any ****** guy that has done FMX's.
Have you done a pressure check? Tap into the 1/8" pipe plug behind the throttle lever on the left side of the case. If line pressure falls to near zero at idle in drive, the clutch seals may be bad. The front pump doesn't put out a lot at idle so an internal leak may drop the pressure through a cracked seal, causing it to feel like it went to neutral. Also, you have a rear pump that is driven by the drive shaft. It's output has to coordinate with the front pump. A sticky valve may be dumping pressure as the rear pump stops rotating. I forget the details here. Your shop manual should have pressure specs.
You need a gauge that goes to about 250-300#.
 
40 Deluxe said:
Your trans is very similar in design to the FMX series used by Ford up into the '80's. Some parts even interchange. So your trans should not be a mystery to any ****** guy that has done FMX's.
Have you done a pressure check? Tap into the 1/8" pipe plug behind the throttle lever on the left side of the case. If line pressure falls to near zero at idle in drive, the clutch seals may be bad. The front pump doesn't put out a lot at idle so an internal leak may drop the pressure through a cracked seal, causing it to feel like it went to neutral. Also, you have a rear pump that is driven by the drive shaft. It's output has to coordinate with the front pump. A sticky valve may be dumping pressure as the rear pump stops rotating. I forget the details here. Your shop manual should have pressure specs.
You need a gauge that goes to about 250-300#.
Click to expand...

Nope no pressure test done. don't have a pressure gauge that goes to those pressures.

as far as feel like its going into neutral its not a feeling it is dropping out of gear, as I come to a stop as speed slows down just before stopping I hear a whine get louder and you hit the gas and it whines like its low on transmission fluid. Drop it into L it shifts into gear.

the more I drove it by time I was almost home from a little 2 or 3 mile drive it felt like it was getting better and wasn't dropping out as soon it took a bit slower to drop out of gear. Before it seemed like 10 - 15 mph and it would start to slip out when I pulled in my driveway after my first test drive I slowed down to almost a complete stop before it fell out of gear I was probably around 2 or 3 mph when it slipped out of gear the last time.

Strange thing is if I go out and start the car right now shift it into reverse it goes into gear at full idle and stays in gear. Drop it into D it whines then slips into gear and it will stay in gear. But when I drive it coming to a stop is when it wants to fall out of gear. I can sit there and let it idle in drive for half an hour and it wont fall out of gear. That is what is confusing me on this.

That's why I cant clearly say what is going on as if it was a leaking clutch pack then wouldn't it just sit there and whine at idle in gear reguardless if I am coming to a stop or if I am sitting still and I shift into gear?
 
packrat5 said:
Internal leakage from worn/cracked/hardened seals. It's over 60 years old, what do you expect from this poor thing? Get it redone. And no, snake oil won't fix it.
Click to expand...

I don't believe its a internal leakage. I can go start the car up right now warm it up put it in drive and sit there with my foot on the break and after its initial whine to go into gear it will sit there and stay in gear till I take it out of gear.

While driving it drives fine but when I hit the brakes to come to a stop initially 10 to 15 mph when I hit this point the transmission started to whine and slip out of gear.

After my 2 or 3 mile drive as I pulled in the driveway it wasn't cutting out at 10 to 15 mph I was almost at a complete stop when it cut out on me the last time. But I don't want to drive it to see if it will correct itself as hopefully sticking internals due to sitting so long.

This is what is confusing me on this as this doesn't act like a leaking seal for a low speed clutch pack. If that was the case this thing shouldn't go into gear at all at idle but it will go into gear initially its when you drive and come to a stop that it did it to me.
 
Ive been doing some reading in my digital transmission shop manual.

One thing im not sure if I am understanding right but from what I am understanding is the rear pump driven by the driveshaft is what powers the transmission hydraulically while moving and the front pump is what powers the transmission hydraulically while idling and at slow speeds below 25 mph.

Ok since this problem comes up when braking and coming to a stop I wonder if what ever controls the transfer from the rear pump to the front pump could be causing this problem. I cant find exactly what controls this but I thought maybe something in the pan could be causing a restriction but looking at diagrams and photos the front pump feeds directly off the front of the mesh filter while the rear pump feeds directly off the rear of the same mesh filter. Only thing I could possibly see is maybe a o ring if there is one that is causing the front pump to suck air from above the fluid level but I don't see nothing there to verify if there are O rings up there.
 
Another thing, since I will have the pan off and the bands weren't adjusted since the last service 79,000 miles ago, I don't have the tools that it calls for to make the front and rear band adjustments.

I wanted to ask would doing the adjustments this way be right? A guy asked I see about the tool when I was searching for it and he was provided this.

https://www.fatsco.net/assets/fm2-band-adj.pdf
 
The FOM with dual pumps are just redundant so the car can be towed. The front pump is the main pump but the rear pump allows the car to be push started and towed without internal damage.

There are several things that could be causing your problems. First thing I'd check is TV pressure at idle. It has to have the correct pressure to hold it in gear. If pressure can't be positively adjusted with the TV rod adjustment then there is a fluid leak somewhere. It could also be a loose band adjustment. Either the fluid pressure isn't enough to hold the band actuator tight or it may need a band adjustment.

These old transmissions had no modulator so fluid pressure is all controlled by the throttle valve (TV rod). At idle it should be between 60 & 80 psi. The higher the throttle setting the more pressure it needs to get positive shift and hold enough pressure on the clutches. I think the highest pressure wouldn't exceed 160 psi so the gauge needed isn't all that bad to source & use but a person has to have hose & fittings to attach it.

They used this system till the vacuum modulator was added in 1961 or so. They started using it again when the AOD came out in 1979 or 80. The set up is very reliable as long as it is correctly adjusted. If it is correctly adjusted then it's something else causing the problem.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top