Ford flathead on Russian KGB car

Hi Sven, nice car. Are you sure your GAZ had a V8. Most were straight 6 cyl and the hood was a little longer. I guess if you still have the original radiator it would be obvious if it was a 6 or 8. Anyhow i have a gearbox from my 6 cyl GAZ here in The Netherlands. It,s a big heavy gearbox, similar to the Ford Flathead light truck gearbox, nothing like the V8 Flathead car gearbox. My car was missing it,s engine as well. How many springs under your car ? My GAZ has 4 parallel leaf springs , the USA Ford would have 2 transverse springs.
 
There is this article on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAZ-M1

Interesting that some of the NKVD cars had "high output" engines imported from the US. 221 inch V8s maybe? Also sounds like they might have had 4 bangers in them for most of the production and then the Dodge 6 cyl engine that 34 GAZ refers to.

I'm fascinated by how the Fords popped up everywhere. Also by how well many of our foreign members speak English.

John
 
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J Witt said:
There is this article on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAZ-M1


I'm fascinated by how the Fords popped up everywhere. Also by how well many of our foreign members speak English.

John
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Model As and V8s were assembled here in Amsterdam at the Ford factory.
BTW i could speak fluent English from my 3rd or 4th year :D, can,t remember exactly. That,s me in my avatar washing dads then new :cool: FJ HOLDEN.
I,m an Ex :eek: AUSSIE ,
 
SofaKing said:
Tere Sven,
Nice car. Where are you in Estonia? I was supposed to visit Tartu in May from Pskov but the FSB wouldn't give me a multi-entry visa, even after I answered all their stupid questions about where I went to elementary school. I was in Tallinn a few years ago, beautiful place.

You might want to post photos of the engine compartment and under-carriage. The guys here will be better able to identify everything you are missing and the differences between yours and US versions.
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Tere!

I'm quite close to Tartu, actually in Võru - it's 69 km to Tartu from here.

Engine room has been rebuilt - somebody has but GAZ 24 engine on.
 
tubman said:
I'm no expert on Model 40's, but if that had an US made grille, I'd have a hell of a hard time not thinking it was an American version. Did the Russians copy the body panels, or did they design their own?
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Yes this GAZ M1 was a copy of Ford 40. Only the axles and suspension was made stronger, because of the roads were bad.
 
34 GAZ said:
Hi Sven, nice car. Are you sure your GAZ had a V8. Most were straight 6 cyl and the hood was a little longer. I guess if you still have the original radiator it would be obvious if it was a 6 or 8. Anyhow i have a gearbox from my 6 cyl GAZ here in The Netherlands. It,s a big heavy gearbox, similar to the Ford Flathead light truck gearbox, nothing like the V8 Flathead car gearbox. My car was missing it,s engine as well. How many springs under your car ? My GAZ has 4 parallel leaf springs , the USA Ford would have 2 transverse springs.
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Hi, This GAZ you have with that gearbox, can be GAZ 12 (ZIM), which had half automatic gearbox.
 
As I understand it Stalin got one over Henry. He got Henry to set up a Model A factory in Russia and then took it over as GAZ and never paid a cent in royalties . Henry lost millions ! Stalin was also impressed with the B-17 Bomber and got his engineers to copy an interned example . This they faithfully did, right down to the rough and ready repairs for combat damage -I guess no one wanted to end up in the Gulag for an inaccurate copy!
 
Thank everybody for comments and help. I did find some engines in America, but also closer for me - from Sweden.
I just need to be sure, that it's correct engine, because in internet it's a big mess about it.
NKVD or later KGB cars GAZ M1V8 with ford flathead engines were produced from 1938 – 1941
In Wikipedia is written, that this was 221 cu.inc. 65 hp engines, but on Ford engines page is Inf. That this engines were made only 1932 – 1936. In Russian books is several facts, that in 1941 German bombardiers destroy Russian engine plant in Nizny Novgorod where Russian prototype Of Dodge D5 engines were produced. This engines this time were installed to Soviet light tanks T 60.
After destroying this factory, soviets took off almost all engines from NKVD cars and installed them to tanks T 60, but by literature this engines is now 90 hp. 90 hp engines start to made by Ford only from 1939 (V8-91A). I cannot believe, that America sold to Russia this engines after Nazi-Soviet agreement, what was written in 1939. In summer offensive in South of Russia German and Romanian forces capture big numbers of tanks T 60, because they was to weak and very light armed. Now they served Germans and their alliance as pulling the artillery or some were rebuild as antiaircraft canons.
Of course some of them with Ford engines. In 1942 production of tanks T 60 was finished.
In my opinion engines, what were sold to Russia were V8-78 85 hp. Production starts In 1936 and as I found out, they was very popular. The original engine of GAZ M1 was 50 hp R4 3,5 l
Does anybody have any correct information, what type of engines were installed on GAZ M1V8, or where to find that information.
 
The Lend Lease Act started a good bit after September of 1939. Somewhere in 1940 we started sneaking stuff around until March of 1941 when the act was passed by the US Congress. It was a long route to the North Sea ports from the pacific side to get equipment to the Soviets. After December of 1941 when Japan brought the US into the war, only the Soviet ships could pass through Pacific & Arctic waters to move the equipment. We sent a lot of trucks such as big Studebaker & Ford 6-cylinder types. We gave them fighter planes like the Bell P-39s & Curtiss P-40s that the powers that be considered obsolete. I/m sure we crammed the boats as full as what they would carry. The Wehrmacht found out what winter war was like after November 1941. I think the cold weather was worse for them than the combat. The trucks & equipment we sent seemed to perform well from all accounts. The Ford V8 engines sent were likely 1941/42 90 HP 239 cid types. The GAZ cars were probably used for NKVD duty around that time frame. Things were pretty rough for all the people involved in that early part of the war for sure. I imagine a lot of vehicles were modified or reworked to do combat duties on both sides of the front lines.

I would not even know where to start looking to find out what was actually sent to and used by the Soviets during the Lend-Lease Act time frame. The US wasn't saying too much about it for good reason. The UK sent a lot of stuff too. It was only after the war that some of this information started to slowly come into the light. The Cold War didn't help that much either.
 
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About 15 years ago, I was in Sevastopol, Ukraine (now Russia), at the WWII historical museum there. Parked outside on display was one of the small Y-Fords. Looked a lot like a 33-6 Willys 4DR sedan. Had the parallel springs but couldn't see the motor or other details because of a barrier. Sign stated it was used as a general's staff car. My step son said he thought he had seen others still in use around Ukraine. I told him to find one, if possible, but he said it would cost a fortune to pay the necessary bribes to get it exported from the country. Neat looking car.
 
Newc said:
Hi all; For our EU vehicle fans... The UK and EU military vehicle site is HMVP . based in the UK it handles all military vehicles and their engines.. Canadian V8 Ford built for the commonwealth.... right hand drive also... Russian GAZ ect.. Newc
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What is the actual website for this?


Kirk
 
This might help in your search;

http://autobuy.ru/wpage/55601

http://en.wheelsage.org/gaz/chayka/14/

You may want to try this forum for further info,
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/neglected-overlooked-v8s.455277/

http://rbth.com/multimedia/pictures/2013/03/12/62_years_of_soviet_cars_history_23753

http://www.earlyfordv8.org/classifieds.cfm?t=For Sale&c=Parts

http://www.earlyfordv8.org/forum/

http://www.earlyfordv8.org/International_Regional_Groups.cfm

http://www.earlyfordv8.org/Contact_Us.cfm

http://www.macsautoparts.com/ford_mercury_early/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAZ#/media/File:Sevastopol_Victory_Day_Parade_GAZ-M1_IMG_1572_1725.jpg

http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/flathead_specs-85to100mid.htm

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/ford-flathead-block-identification.594463/

http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/How_to_identify_a_Ford_V8#1938-1942

http://www.45cui.com/45cui/tech/ford-flathead-engine-identification-part-1

http://www.goldengatev8.org/tips/EvolutionOfTheFlathead.pdf

http://www.btc-bci.com/~billben/flathead.htm

http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/ABenginenumbers.htm
http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/ABenginenumbers.htm

https://books.google.com/books?id=D...onepage&q=ford v8 engines in gaz cars&f=false
 
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My father was in a US Army reconnaissance unit operating in Hungary at the end of WWII, before the border territory had been settled with the Soviets. It was all copacetic with the Russians as long as there was enough confiscated local alcohol, but when that ran low they got a bit cranky. He was amazed at how much of their rolling stock was Ford powered.
 
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