3 deuces on a 1961 390

SuperDave

SuperDave

Senior Member
Customer brought me a three deuce manifold and three carbs. Everything looks rebuilt or new. I need a picture of the progressive linkage. This is a 390 2bbl automatic Starliner. It also appears that I will need different throttle linkage from the firewall.. anyone have some pictures to share?:confused:
 
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We are just doing the same swap. 390, 3x2's (gm carbs on this one) in a 1960 Starliner.
We have the linkage but haven't hooked it up yet. Got it from Speedway.
 
Manifold is Ford (has logo cast in). Carbs are Holley numbers that appear are C1AE9510 AU (two of them) and the center one has suffix AV. Manifold has oil breather/filler on right front. Engine has one on the right valve cover. The manifold also has a large diameter hole in the rear. Looks like maybe a road draft tube was there? The two bbl manifold does not have the hole... Different year production? There was some linkage with the parts, but not all. I seem to be missing the progressive clevis and rod that connects to the front carb and a very long rod that would connect the cross shaft to the firewall ?
I cannot get my computers to download pics from my camera..Was working now not!
 
The large hole in the back is to hold a "can" filled with steel wool and the outlet on the top has a fitting that hooks to a convoluted pipe and PCV valve before going into the port on the rear of the manifold. Check with Dennis Carpenter for the correct linkage, I know it is all re-poped, just don't remember who.
 
See if this image helps for the linkage.
1a%203X2%20setup%20rsz.jpg
 
I recently picked up a 61 Starliner 406 w/3x2's and for the last week or so I've been trying to straighten out the previous owners work. Ted's picture of the linkage seems to be the factory set up. I've seen all sorts of combinations on those. That's how I've set mine up. Everyone else's advise is spot on too. You have the correct #'s on the carbs so that's a plus. My experience with 3x2's is you have to start out with 3 good carb bases. Any air leaks from a worn out base will throw it out of whack. Another tip is to block off the outer carbs with plates and get it to run good on the center carb first. Then add the secondary carbs. If you end up needing bases I found some on Amazon for 38$ a piece from a place called Speedmaster.
 
I found a clevis to use on the front carb. So nowI am in the process of removing the original manifold. Between "Honey do's". Yes any advice on tuning is much appreciated.
Where can I tap in manifold vacuum for the distributor?
I see that the heat tube for the choke is on the drivers side now, so I made a longer insulated tube and ran it between the #1&2 carbs to reach the right side exhaust manifold.
Adapting the firewall mounted throttle will be fun ! There is a kickdown rod to the transmission that has to work.. hmmm
These carbs are supposed to be remanufactured. They are beautiful,,, BUT I do see a little lateral motion in the throttle plate shafts. I know from experience that it screws up the idle mixture.
 
A vacuum source for the FE distributor needs to be from a staged or ported vacuum source at the carburetor. On most factory Ford Holley carbs, that vacuum source would come off of the passenger side of the primary side metering block on a normally orientated carb. The factory center carb on a Ford 3X2 setup would have to be modified to get the proper signal to the distributor. In the case of the Ford 3X2 setup, the carbs are mounted backwards which would put a normally positioned staged vacuum port on the drivers side of the center carb. I'd be happy with a expertly or factory curved non-vacuum advance distributor in this instance.
 
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Thanks to all you guys that have responded. I know that the vacuum port is very critical and "guessing" where to drill is NOT the way to go. I may suggest that the owner purchase a mechanical distributor. He has a 39 mercury that has been modified with a electronic, mechanical distributor, so I know he isn't worried about "ORIGINALITY".
Last thing I did today was remove the old 2bbl manifold.. good grief! I am 76 and 140 lbs. soak and wet. That thing is heavy! I think the last time I did a valve job on a 390 was in the 70's,, I must have been a little stronger back in the day! LOL.
 
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A couple more questions.
In the picture of the linkage. Is the adjustment on the sliders about "right" for a trial?
Where can a mechanical advance distributor be purchased? I find them for other Ford engines, but not 390.. How did the factory do it?
 
It has been nearly 30 years since I had my tri power set up. Yes those linkages look close to being correctly set. If I remember correctly the front carb starts tipping in before the rear. With the throttle wide open both outers should be wide open as well.

For tuning I used a piece of heater hose and listened to the "noise" each carb made in it's throat to set the idle on each of them. Then the vacumm gauge to set the mixture and back to the hose to listen again.

Later on I did make an adapter to use a unisin to set the idle.
 
It's not possible for the front carb to start opening before the rear one, and both each wide open at the same time with that set up. They should start to open at the same time and reach WOT at the same time. All three carbs reach WOT at the same time is how it was made.

Sal
 
I'm still wondering how the factory took care of the vacuum advance. I have been told that if you wanted 3 2's in 1961 (when you ordered the car) the parts were in the trunk for the dealer to install. Is that correct? Are the carbs I have the same as ford provided? If so, what did they do for the advance?
I have found that Pertronix has several mechanical distributors. About $300 ...Ouch.
 
The 375HP & 401HP 390's and the 385HP & 405HP 406's used centrifugal advance dual point distributors without vacuum capability. Never saw the 340HP 3X2 equipped 390 in a Thunderbird so I can't say what it had for a distributor. Ted Eaton.
 
Made my own throttle rod and connected it directly to the accelerator pedal rod. Had to bend that rod to make it more vertical. Welded a tab on the rod to attach the kickdown switch. The darned thing starts and runs!! Hoorayyy.. I used the original vacuum distributor just to get it running. Will consult with the owner about the correct fix for that.. This was a "character building" experience!
Thanks everyone that chimed in.. it really helped!

Now back to the problem it had when it arrived at the shop.. The shift lever has to be in between Park and reverse. Tried cleaning and adjusting the switch with no help. I posted another thread on that problem. Of course, as soon as the engine starts, it wants to pop into reverse.

A little research on this car uncovered that this was a 352 with a 2bbl carb originally. The engine that is in the car is not the original. Had decals on the valve cover. "POLICE" and "390" I found out that it wasn't police because it has hydraulic lifters. Is it a 390? Can't tell without measuring the stroke. I think three twos is a bit much for a 352,(if that is what it is) just my opinion. But it does look cool!
 
I ran the tri power on my F100 360/4speed. Jetted the center and outer carbs down, too long ago to remember the sizes. As long as I kept the right foot under control it gave 2 MPG more then the stock 2bbl/manifold. Just can't beat the looks!
 
TedEaton said:
The 375HP & 401HP 390's and the 385HP & 405HP 406's used centrifugal advance dual point distributors without vacuum capability. Never saw the 340HP 3X2 equipped 390 in a Thunderbird so I can't say what it had for a distributor. Ted Eaton.
Click to expand...

The "M"-series Thunderbird Special 390/340 HP used a single-point vacuum advance distributor. Vacuum came off of the driver's side of the center carb's metering block, with a brass fitting screwed into the place where the adjustment screw (?) is typically found. The vacuum advance line had a tall loop in it to limit the potential for fuel to seep back to the vacuum diaphragm. The distributor's only real difference is that it had heavier secondary advance springs. There are a number of other "small" differences between the "M" setup and the tri-power for Galaxies that I won't go into unless prodded to.
 
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