31 S/W fuel line and water pump help requested

brianpharmd

brianpharmd

Senior Member
So I have recently purchased a 1931 S/W 160B sedan. I need to replace the copper tubing that the previous owner has used as the fuel line from the indented firewall shut off valve and a standard Zenith carburetor (not a side bowl mount). I was thinking of adding a positive shut off valve to the replacement fuel line. However, I need some input/pictures on how to do this. Which types of fuel line(s) do I need to purchase? Do I only need the indented firewall fuel line and cut it in the middle to add the positive shut off valve?
I know I have what appears to be some leaking at the shut off valve now so I have a replacement packing kit to try and correct this issue. I just really want to ensure that the fuel is shut off to the carburetor.
Lastly, I need to replace the 2 blade fan and the water pump. I plan to purchase a leakless one. I also plan to purchase the water pump mounting stud bolts so that I do not have to remove/move the radiator if I need to work on the water pump in the future. Any tips on how to get the existing studs for the water pump out of the block? Also, which of the 4 stud bolts do I need to add sealant to so that the water does not leak out? I think that it is 2 of the 4 but I don't know which ones.
 

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Any luck with those? I think I saw one on Bert's as well and a previous thread by someone that installed the same thing. Problem is, the person that I saw that installed one just recently sold his 31 S/W on this site!
 
Also, if I use that sediment bowl, is it the same as the glass ones on the 30/31 cars? That way I can use the spare screens/gaskets I have for my 30 coupe in this bowl.
 
Brian
I would purchase a standard Indented Fire wall steel fuel line and cut it and put in a 1/4" compression type shut off valve from your local hard ware store. I have done this on my cars.
 
I'm also interested in the answer to Brian's second question: How do you get the stud bolts out of the block where the water pump mounts . I just ordered a new water pump and would like to replace the studs with bolts, which I also ordered today. As asked, which bolts do you need to put sealant on (I did read another thread where Mitch said one of the top bolts) and do you just coat the threads with Permatex Gasket sealant, or do you use something else. Of course I'd want to easily remove the bolt in the future. Would you recommend using anti seize compound on the other bolts or just use sealant on all 4 to prevent them being a problem for future removal.
 
It's the upper right that is a thru-hole (upper left if standing in front of the engine). I just use Permatex black on all the bolts, a little extra on the upper right. I wouldn't use anti-seize on any of them. JMHO
 
Houdini - Here is what was passed along to me about how to get the water pump studs out of the block by one of our club members:

"You can get the studs out by double nutting them, or us a pipe wrench or vise grips. You could use a stud remover, but I'm sure you do not have one."

Hope that helps.

Brian
 
why not use the automatic fuel shut off.
 

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Mark,

That is an interesting option. This would keep me from having to open the hood each time to shut off the valve. Do you have a sediment bowl on there as well? I am guessing you might have a side bowl mount but the 2nd picture did not show all the way down to the carb. My thought would be I would still need to install some type of sediment bowl as to ensure particulate matter does not enter the jets.

Does anyone out there in Ford Barn have any experience with these automatic shut of valves? I searched the forum using "automatic; fuel; shut off" and did not come across any relevant threads.

Thanks,

Brian
 
Some of the older John Deere tractors had a vacuum operated fuel shut off valve.
That would be a neat option for the Model A.
 
Tom,those were used on a lot of the two cylinder tractors,but were actually oil pressure operated.The valve was pretty big around,and looked like a vacuum operated can.They worked very well.The problem with those tractors was that they were prone to making water in the crankcase.The governor/fan drive assembly was on top,and produces a lot of condensate.It only took a little ice in the bottom to fetch up the oil pump,and the oil pump drive was lighter than the drive on an A.If you cranked it over with ice in it,the drive would shear right off.With that fuel shutoff though it would only run for a few seconds and quit with no pressure.You also never had leaky carbs because the fuel shut off every time you shut off the tractor.When I worked at the John Deere dealer I was the two cylinder man there.That was a very common ailment with them.If the tractor started smoking a lot,the diaphragm had gone bad.Same thing if you checked the oil one morning and found the crankcase full of gas.It was pretty much a yearly thing to happen on those tractors.$2.part,one hour fix.All in all,I still think it was a perfect setup.
 
I have used the shut-off valve that Mark shows in post #10, but ahead of that I have the sediment bowl that Bob shows in post #2. That combination works great.
 
Please keep in mind that a proper working original valve does the shut off quite fine. Though I can understand not wanting to lift the hood all the time.

What I have found is the original filter screens do a very very good job and the original carb can take the small amount of crap that gets by the filter. The big issue is monitoring what kind of dirt and how fast it accumulates. You should ideally see the amount of junk slow down over time as the tank self cleans.
The addition of another filter really should not be taken lightly as it is a possible problem point that is not really needed. Keep the car simple and it simple keeps running.
 
brianpharmd said:
So I have recently purchased a 1931 S/W 160B sedan. I need to replace the copper tubing that the previous owner has used as the fuel line from the indented firewall shut off valve and a standard Zenith carburetor (not a side bowl mount). I was thinking of adding a positive shut off valve to the replacement fuel line. However, I need some input/pictures on how to do this. Which types of fuel line(s) do I need to purchase? Do I only need the indented firewall fuel line and cut it in the middle to add the positive shut off valve?
I know I have what appears to be some leaking at the shut off valve now so I have a replacement packing kit to try and correct this issue. I just really want to ensure that the fuel is shut off to the carburetor.
Lastly, I need to replace the 2 blade fan and the water pump. I plan to purchase a leakless one. I also plan to purchase the water pump mounting stud bolts so that I do not have to remove/move the radiator if I need to work on the water pump in the future. Any tips on how to get the existing studs for the water pump out of the block? Also, which of the 4 stud bolts do I need to add sealant to so that the water does not leak out? I think that it is 2 of the 4 but I don't know which ones.
Click to expand...

You need a Brattons catalog. They have everything you need. Check them out at www.brattons,com.
 
here is what the set up on Miss Mibble looks like. Bought and installed the elec shut off from either Snyders or Berts 5 or 6 years ago. Never had a problem with it. It can be installed anywhere in the fuel line you choose. Simple cut the line where yu want the valve and install with two 1/4" (I think that size is right) compression fittings. The electric feed line is then run to the ignition side of the coil. Turn the key on and the elec valve opens.

Wait a minute - just thot. If you are running the Henry type of ignition with popout cable, a separate switch may have to be installed.
 

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Brian , on the water pump if you have a four blade in it now that's a non bolt on style hub and you don't want to remove the radiator you can use a sawzall and cut the pump and shaft In two for an easy removal , sure you toast the pump but your buying a new one anyway with new 2 blade aluminum fan. It's a time saver and is less evasive. Just blanket the front of the engine to catch shavings .

I know its popular to use the new studs , although against popular belief it's not the studs that are generally the problem getting a pump out and back in, it's the impeller and its closeness and radiator closeness that causes the issue. There are those that will disagree but I've done it to many times to be buffaloed .
Sometimes putting a little more bevel in the impeller fins helps and doesn't affect the flow.
Just enough to clear the head if need be.

If you feel inclined to do the studs they can be double nutted to be removed .

I agree with Kevin on the filter/line . Or you can use one of the glass augmentive bowls and an inline shutoff, although if you replace/fix the original shutoff that would fix the issue which would've my preference

Larry Shepard
 
Thanks everyone for the feedback. I have been ordering from Bratton's now for several years so I am familiar with their catalog.

I have to reinstall a repaired radiator so I will have direct access to the water pump/fan. So I don't think I will need to cut the pump.

I don't have a problem repacking the existing fuel shut off valve to address any leaking fuel issues and replacing the Cu line. I just wanted something that would filter correctly and I could avoid opening the hood. For me, it is so easy to catch a hood corner on the fender or a rivet on the gas tank lacing/cowl light.

I believe I have the information I need. I will order my parts and work on installing eveything next week. Thanks for the feedback, especially concerning the fuel shut off system.
 
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