Front and Rear Engine Seals

[johnr9q@yahoo.com]

I have the rod bearings all in tolerance now so I will install the pan. Do I replace the front and rear seals? It looks to me like the front seal that is in the block can't be replaced unless the crank is removed but I can replace the corresponding gasket that is in the pan. As far as the rear seal it looks to me like the upper part of that seal can't be replaced unless the crankshaft is removed but the corresponding cork seal on the bottom, that interfaces with the pan, is to be replaced,

 

[Joe K]

The front seal is part of the front cover plate. You can remove the cover plate with the engine removed from the supports. If you lift the engine (like at the 3rd spark plug lift accessory) you can remove the front Y support which will allow you to remove the eight or so bolts that attach the cover to the engine block.

The rear seal is not unless your engine has had the crank "turned", the oil slinger removed by machining, and a fibrous seal added. Many do this modification to slow down the tendency of the Model A to "mark it's spot."

There is a square cork seal between the rear bearing shell and the oil pan - but I think we discussed this when you were interested in dropping the oil pan.

Joe K

 

[old ugly]

unless your engine has been machined for one there is no rear crank seal. just a slinger.
there is a cork gasket that wraps onto the rear main bearing cap.

like said above to replace the front seal, both top and bottom halfs, that front cover has to come off.
if it were me and if the front seal didn't leak to bad i would fit a new bottom half of the front seal and good to go. that goose turd should have come in your pan gasket set.

tip.
put that cork main bearing gasket and the flange gaskets on the engine first and not onto the pan. that way you can make sure the rear mating surfaces are lined up. and with a dab of sealer.
put some studs or short threaded rod into a couple of the pan bolt holes. this will line up the pan as you raise it into position. you can then hold the pan up with one hand and put some nuts on those studs to support it while you make sure the gaskets are properly aligned then put the pan bolts in.

 

[johnr9q@yahoo.com]

Old Ugly. thanks. I don't understand how I will get the front "Goose Turd" to stay in place while I install the pan? What are the "flange gaskets"? What sealer do I use as a "dab of sealer" and where do I put it?

 

[Y-Blockhead]

These "oil pan holder uppers" help a lot when installing the pan and lining everything up.

https://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/product.htm?pid=978874&cat=41753

 

[Bob C]

Here's an article on installing the pan gaskets.
https://sacramentocapitolas.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/leakless-pan-gasket-article.pdf

 

[Joe K]

I laughed when I saw "goose turd" - because that is EXACTLY what the white-grey half segment of front crankshaft seal looks like.

Imagine a powdered donut - now cut it in half. Half goes on the top half of the crankshaft, the other half goes on the bottom. The resemblance to a goose turd is in the color and shape, not the taste.

If your engine is in place and "upright" - the lower seal holds in place in the oil pan for assembly by gravity. Your upper seal is the challenge - except its a kind of a tight fit in place between the "flanges" of the seal seat. You can help it with some "gukum putty" sealant like Permatex No. 2 which can be put up in the slot before applying the seal and helps hold it in place. You almost want to "hammer" the upper seal in place by using a segment of dowel held sideways and striking with a hammer/mallet.

The whole process of re-assembling the oil pan to the engine is a LOT easier with the engine removed and inverted - but working "in situ" is possible.

As to the rear - that same "in situ" exists but putting and trimming the square cork is the challenge and how exactly you do this depends on whether you put the flat gaskets in place first - and how exactly you apply - whether to the pan flange or the block flange.

Again - upside down is how Ford did it - and he did it this way in "manufacturing expediency." But right-side up is possible.

Permatex No. 2 is your friend.

Joe K

 

[Fullraceflathead]

Using the sides of a large socket you can use that to help push the rope seal into place.

 

[old ugly]

i am assuming the engine is still in the car.

a thin smear of Permatex gasket maker on the CLEAN bottom edges of the engine block, the block to pan mating surfaces. not big gobbs of gasket maker a nice even coating. stick the pan gaskets to that making sure that all the holes are lined up and the rear cork fits it nice, you may need to trim the ends of the thick cork gasket for proper fit. put a dab o gasket maker where that cork meets the pan gaskets.
stick that new OILED goose turd into the oil pan front recess. roll it in nice with a socket that is a tiny bit smaller than the pully. make sure it is all the way in. then trim the ends of it so it will mate up nicely with the top 1/2 section. put a dab of Permatex on each of its ends
then put the pan on without disturbing the gaskets.
the front bolts may need to be snugged up slowly and evenly so that turd is squished around the pully.

 

[katy]

I laughed when I saw "goose turd" - because that is EXACTLY what the white-grey half segment of front crankshaft seal looks like.
Joe K

When we used to get parts from The Ford dealer the parts guy called them "Chicken sh*ts"