manmerc5519
Junior Member
Removing 302 from 55 Merc Monclair for a 352 what mounts would i use for this motor it came out ford truck. not sure of what year.I am changing motor and ****** al togeather will i have very many problems.
motor mounts
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JeffB2
Well-known member
These are what you will need. https://www.ebay.com/itm/2811210858...e:Ford&hash=item41741f59c9:g:nO4AAMXQ2UVQ8Gy6
The mounts are the same from 54-58 all V8. Most say they need to be swapped side to side, but since they are the same, I think that means reverse them from their normal position by flipping them which causes the motor to be moved either further forward or back toward firewall.
If the 352 is later than 58, your driver side manifold may hit the steering box. I am considering a 390 into a 56 Merc and since 390 is the same profile/dimensions as a 352, the same issues apply to either engine. I can get pics of the 58 driver side manifold if desired.
Even a 58 manifold may also hit the inner edge of the driver side upper A arm frame mount. Some have raised the motor with a plate under engine mount or trimmed a bit off the inner edge of that to get clearance.
Discussed this swap on HAMB 52-59 Ford social group recently along with several other engines and crossmember repairs. "56 Mercury engine swap. Anyone done a 400M?"
If the 352 is later than 58, your driver side manifold may hit the steering box. I am considering a 390 into a 56 Merc and since 390 is the same profile/dimensions as a 352, the same issues apply to either engine. I can get pics of the 58 driver side manifold if desired.
Even a 58 manifold may also hit the inner edge of the driver side upper A arm frame mount. Some have raised the motor with a plate under engine mount or trimmed a bit off the inner edge of that to get clearance.
Discussed this swap on HAMB 52-59 Ford social group recently along with several other engines and crossmember repairs. "56 Mercury engine swap. Anyone done a 400M?"
I have a lot of FE manifolds, but being dark out I can't check any still in cars. I do have a couple hanging on the wall, one of which I believe came off a 58 332 with the machined chamber heads (5750731 E 08). The other came off a 58 Ford convertible IIRC (EDC9431A 70 backwards C)
The profiles of both left side manifolds is almost the same. But one has a tapped fitting for heat riser tube or something and the other does not. Otherwise they appear identical with the recessed top profile on the top at the rear to clear the steering box.
The profiles of both left side manifolds is almost the same. But one has a tapped fitting for heat riser tube or something and the other does not. Otherwise they appear identical with the recessed top profile on the top at the rear to clear the steering box.
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I have a 59 332 engine sitting in one 58 retractable that I believe is all original (the engine itself) and a 58 four door that is in pretty decent shape for a project car and supposed to be all original. There are a couple more 58 retractables out there, but one has a 64 engine and the other I can't remember if it still has exhaust manifolds still on it. All are FE's though.
But, I can check those tomorrow if you like, though idk if I can see the casting numbers on those cuz except one they have front clips on them. I have bears and coyotes coming in the yard sometimes, so I don't venture out back at night usually...
But, I can check those tomorrow if you like, though idk if I can see the casting numbers on those cuz except one they have front clips on them. I have bears and coyotes coming in the yard sometimes, so I don't venture out back at night usually...
The 57 and 58 Ford steering gear boxes are different as mentioned already. Besides internal changes the profile of the 58 steering gear top is narrower and has a 3 bolt cast cover. The 57 has a 4 bolt cover that would intrude on an FE exhaust manifold.
As far as the Merc's IDK if 55 and 56 are the same or not. My 56 Merc has a 3 bolt cover with a narrow profile just like a 58 Ford steering gear, but my 55 Ford has a 4 bolt cover that does not look FE friendly.
If you have a 4 bolt cover on the steering gear on your 55 Merc you may have to change to a 56 Merc steering gear, even with a 58 narrow profile left exhaust manifold. If it has a 3 bolt cover with flat side toward the engine, you should be OK as far as that manifold clearance issue as long as an early FE driver side manifold is used.
As far as the Merc's IDK if 55 and 56 are the same or not. My 56 Merc has a 3 bolt cover with a narrow profile just like a 58 Ford steering gear, but my 55 Ford has a 4 bolt cover that does not look FE friendly.
If you have a 4 bolt cover on the steering gear on your 55 Merc you may have to change to a 56 Merc steering gear, even with a 58 narrow profile left exhaust manifold. If it has a 3 bolt cover with flat side toward the engine, you should be OK as far as that manifold clearance issue as long as an early FE driver side manifold is used.
Do you know if Merc did the same as Ford and changed to a different steering box in mid-1956? And if so you can tell the difference by whether there are 3 or 4 bolts on the top cover? Or was that strictly an internal mechanical improvement and did not change the box profile in 1956?
Total guess, but I suspect that being both the FE and MEL engines were probably on the drawing board by mid-1956, that they were at least contemplating eventually using one or both of them in Mercury as early as 1956. As previously mentioned my 56 Merc has a narrow profile 3 bolt cover that visibly resembles a 58 Ford steering gear.
Since the MEL originally had upswept exhaust manifolds though, I would be inclined to think it was the imminent FE that was the motivation to slim down both Ford and Merc steering boxes by 1958 on both makes.
And perhaps even earlier on the Mercs since the manufacturers tended to try out new innovations in lower volume makes or models before using them across the board in their big volume sellers. (Recall the 4100 Cadillac disastrous new engine that evolved into the fairly successful 4500 and 4900 versions).
I had a different 57 convertible way back and stuck a 58 Merc 430 in it with a 1961 T85 OD and had no issues with 57 steering box clearance. Makes me wonder whether an early 58-60 MEL engine would fit in a 56 Merc or Ford too..
KULTULZ
Well-known member
It seems MERC got fancy one model year ahead of FORD. I have photos of both boxes - will have to dig them out. More to follow.
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KULTULZ
Well-known member
The MEL 410 was to be introduced on the 1957 MERC (TPC) but foundry/casting problems pushed it back to be introduced in the 1958 EDSEL. The EDSEL saw the first intro of the FE (361) and MEL (410) as it had an early release date. MERC used the LINC 368 for the TPC in 1957.
I don't remember any trouble installing FE engines into 55 or 56's if you use the early manifolds. It was tight by upper A arm but cleared it. Fastest ride I have ever had was in a 56 Victoria with 427. Sandeson makes a header for the combination I believe, but you have to call. May be expensive but they are quality and know Fords.
KULTULZ
Well-known member
Edsel being the lowest production of Ford products then was the perfect test bed for engines not yet in wide production.
I put a 61 Starliner 390 and its T85 OD in a 54 Ranchwagon and it bolted in with the 61 manifolds, but the left upper A arm eventually broke the left manifold during hard acceleration.
Motor mount flex I assume, but use of a 58-59 manifold probably would not have helped because it broke forward up alongside the arm. Not in the rear by the steering gear. The cure would probably have been to raise the motor a 1/4" with plates under the motor mounts. But I was in my teens, so didn't really know what I was doing anyway...
When the FE motor started burning too much oil I put an early 430 MEL engine in it which actually fit better cuz upswept exhaust manifolds. Everything bolted up with stock Ford parts.
KULTULZ
Well-known member
Well, the 1958 MERC received the 383 and 430 while LINC received the 430 only. The 410 was the first in the MEL SERIES and was meant for MERC HP in 1957. Missing 1957 assembly the 410 was ready/available for the MERC based EDSEL early assembly dates.
That was a good link. May not help the OP with his FE, but it was useful to me cuz that is exactly what I am doing now. 351c into a 57 Fairlane and so far not happy with the several sets of mounts I have tried.
Butch's mounts way too tall for me...
351c 71-73 Mustang way too tall for me...
63-64 Galaxie too short and have to twist the engine on the mounts to make it sit straight. That would probably unduly stress them in actual use. And the engine is still just a tad further forward than I want it...
Next candidate up is 77-78 LTD with SBF, similar to pickup mounts but crossbolt, no stud...
Have to fab an adapter plate between frame and motor mount - IF enough vertical room.
If that doesn't work then the Anchor 2725 and 2726 for fitment analysis only and replace them with the Prothane mounts if the Anchor pieces fit. Have mechanical clutch linkage so can't have the motor flopping around...
Anyone need some extra motor mounts? JK.....
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